Debugging web vs desktop

[Tom Parry]

I was hoping that I could use the debugger to figure out a problem that only occurs in the web client mode and not in the desktop mode. However it seems that if I put a debug breakpoint on a line only accessible if the application type = 5 (vice 3 for desktop) that it never occurs.

So what is the best practice here?

Using 3.5 on windows, Firefox browser.

[grahamg]

Hi Tom

First stop would be the Servoy-Admin page (http://localhost:8080/servoy-admin/ if you are using Developer) - it provides a great deal of info these days and any problems should be showing there.

One thing I have learnt is that debugging WebClient apps can take significantly longer than Rich Client due to the variety of Browsers & OS's. Bob Cusick's original advice to 'test, test, test while developing' is very true.

Regards

Graham Greensall
Worxinfo Ltd

[Tom Parry]

I find it rather interesting that there seems to be very few people on the forum that are asking about testing or debugging their solutions for the web.
I find it very frustrating to have to do trial and error testing when attempting to figure out a web load problem and there are no debug or test aids. In fact it seems to me that there is deliberate obfuscation going on to make it difficult. After this this rant here is my (continuing) problem.

I can launch a simple solution into the web client and it works similar to the smart client. (two forms, one form inside a tabless tabpanel).

If I take a solution originally built for the smart client and attempt to launch in the web client all I get is a terse ERROR LOADING SOLUTION. When I examine all the servoy server log files - nothing is present at all.

I am using 3.5.1, firefox latest, XP Pro.

My steps next are to create a new solution, then "import" forms one by one into this solution and launch into the web until I find one that breaks.
Surely there is a better way? Are there hidden log files or log settings that I can enable to allow me more developer insight?

Even if you have no suggestions perhaps you might like to reply with support or no support for better debugging tools???

Regards,
Tom

[ROCLASI]

Hi Tom,

I find it very frustrating to have to do trial and error testing when attempting to figure out a web load problem and there are no debug or test aids. In fact it seems to me that there is deliberate obfuscation going on to make it difficult.

Why would you say that ?
Our experience is exactly the opposite. The Servoy developers are very forthcoming with any info and quick to respond to any issues or requests.

I can launch a simple solution into the web client and it works similar to the smart client. (two forms, one form inside a tabless tabpanel).

If I take a solution originally built for the smart client and attempt to launch in the web client all I get is a terse ERROR LOADING SOLUTION. When I examine all the servoy server log files - nothing is present at all.

You mean there was nothing on the log page of the servoy admin pages ? Note that there is a filter (combobox) on that page that filter the logs for you.
Set it to debug and you get all info logged.

I am using 3.5.1, firefox latest, XP Pro.

My steps next are to create a new solution, then "import" forms one by one into this solution and launch into the web until I find one that breaks.

Not sure what you mean with importing forms. You mean importing the whole solution in your development environment ?
Debugging and testing is what you do in the development environment so I am confused on why this is a problem for you.

Surely there is a better way? Are there hidden log files or log settings that I can enable to allow me more developer insight?

Even if you have no suggestions perhaps you might like to reply with support or no support for better debugging tools???

For even better debugging tools for webclient you have to wait for Servoy 4.0 where even a breakpoint in the webclient will drop you right back into the method editor (!) but right now you can get a lot of debug info already with the Editor and in the server admin pages.

If there is indeed no debug info logged anywhere when this error occurs then this would be a bug and filed accordingly. Servoy should always log any problems.


Hope this helps.

[grahamg]

Personally, I think it is more efficient to design specifically for WebClient rather than just build/import Rich Client forms and see if they work by trial & error.

Although WebClient is a tremendously productive tool it is constrained by the limitations and variations in Browser technology and therefore cannot match the range of functions we have in SmartClient.

I would suggest you read up the documentation and How-To's on WebClient so that you understand these limitations, then start by designing and building some basic Forms & Relationships and test in a variety of browsers. Once you have a selection of Styles, Forms, Tables that work you can duplicate them and grow your solution pretty rapidly.

If you are having specific problems come back to the Forum - there's usually someone who has had the same issue and can offer advice.

[Tom Parry]

First, let me say that the forum response is very very good. That is not my target.

Second, the point of my issue is that the terse error message in the browser page (error loading solution) and then finding that there are NO logged messages even in debug mode in the servoy log pages is not helping to isolate the errors that I am sure are all my doing.

Following the "lazy programmer paradigm" I was hoping that (a) I could use the method editor/debugger - but it is not available yet or (b) examine some log of errors (not found any yet) or (c) --wishful thinking-- that there might be a "checker" program that could alert me to gui controls or method calls that are not going to work in the web version.

Yes I do agree that it now seems better to design with the web in mind first rather than attempt to lauch the web client after implementing a smart client. Originally I had thought that the marketing hype form Servoy implied that this was all had to do. Finding the limitations out later was not too bad when in design mode but not exciting.

Yes, version 4.x might help with the web client design and testing - we shall see.

Thanks for the good advice - I shall persevere!
Tom

[bcusick]

Hi Tom,

Web Client debugging in Servoy is coming in 4.0. You will be able to even set breakpoints in your method, open Web Client, execute the code and you'll be popped back into the Editor.

In 3.x it's currently not possible to "debug" the Web Client only.

Hope this helps...

[Riccardino]

Following the "lazy programmer paradigm" :wink: I was hoping that (a) I could use the method editor/debugger - but it is not available yet or (b) examine some log of errors (not found any yet) or (c) --wishful thinking-- that there might be a "checker" program that could alert me to gui controls or method calls that are not going to work in the web version.

Ciao, Tom

regarding (c), did you activate the Web Filter, available under View menu?

[Tom Parry]

Yes I did turn on the web filter. However this is only useful when starting from scratch - if you turn this on after importing an existing solution it does not automatically go ahead and flag those gui elements that are not valid for web.

ON a positive note, by examining the templates of the html page produced I could see a small note from Servoy:

field_list field">HTML field not [yet] supported in webclient</div></td>

So why is this not reported up front I ask?
What I had done is embed html codes in a filed - which is ok in smart client but not [yet] allowed for the web. Removing the code (which was a colour highlighter to indicate aging of a date) got rid of this problem.

However I examined all the other fields and calculated columns that might have embedded html and removed the code - now the form displays in the web without errors - albeit with a reduced functionality.

I shall have to found another way to highlight/color a single field/label in a table view form. So far on the forum I have been unsuccessful in finding similar concerns/issues.

Perhaps it would be nice to have someone at Servoy put together all the web tips and gotchas and hidden errors messages for the rest of us...

Now on to the next web gotcha...
Regards,
Tom Parry