Is anyone using jQuery Mobile in conjuncton with Servoy to create smart phone applicatons? If so, I would like to hear about your experiences.
Hi Kim
We made an iPhone App to manage student and teacher absences with just plain Servoy (5.2.13) using graphics for (navigation) controls. Technically, it works, if a WLAN or 3G exists. Nevertheless we stopped, because there are some unresolved UI elements issues we could not implement, like DatePicker (wheel) for example, which iPhone users expect to be there to select a date. Don’t know what the state is with Servoy 6.1, though.
Best regards, Robert
kwpsd:
Is anyone using jQuery Mobile in conjuncton with Servoy to create smart phone applicatons? If so, I would like to hear about your experiences.
kwpsd:
Is anyone using jQuery Mobile in conjuncton with Servoy to create smart phone applicatons? If so, I would like to hear about your experiences.
JQuery Mobile, KendoUI, Sencha, and a few others no one has heard of. KendoUI is probably the easiest to get a handle on for first time developers. A new release just came out a couple of weeks ago and the capabilities and new docs are flat out impressive.
Servoy is a great backend for client-side UI technologies. The trick is how to connect to Servoy’s data and server-side logic. We built our own JSP’s (Servoy Headless Client) for this but now we’re converting over to using Patrick’s Velocity Web Client.
Highly recommend adding a dedicated client-side framework to your development toolkit. Servoy javascript skills translate pretty well too.
At ServoyWorld we announced Servoy Mobile which will allow you to do this as easy as it is creating browser/desktop Servoy apps.
Our goal is to get a copy in your hands before the end of the year, we are currently running two large trials with customers in Germany.
Jan Aleman:
At ServoyWorld we announced Servoy Mobile which will allow you to do this as easy as it is creating browser/desktop Servoy apps.Our goal is to get a copy in your hands before the end of the year, we are currently running two large trials with customers in Germany.
And we know this is true because? Currently quite impressed with 6.1 but I sometimes feel like it magically appeared out of the bowels of a ghost town:
1- Nothing has come out yet from Servoy World 2012 – almost two months past.
2- I haven’t received a Servoy Monthly Newsletter since February, 2012 – five months.
3- Servoy’s Twitter account hasn’t posted anything since 21st of June. Not even a tweet about Servoy 6.1 release – one month.
4- Servoy 6.1 is a huge release with some very cool features and there are no demos or a webinar scheduled to show it off – crickets.
Since this is the first I’ve heard of Servoy Mobile…forgive me if I may have a few reservations and questions…
“Activity is meaningless without visibility.”
Can we get an overview of what Servoy Mobile is/will be? Unfortunately, some of us couldn’t make it to Servoy World.
I was there and it was pretty awesome. But even at Servoy World the demo and presentation of it was pretty low-key, nobody turning cartwheels or rockets going off. Probably if Bob had been there doing it you would have even been able to hear it across the pond. Perhaps it is all part of a cooler, laid-back Servoy image!
keenkenny:
Can we get an overview of what Servoy Mobile is/will be? Unfortunately, some of us couldn’t make it to Servoy World.
Yes, we will soon. At ServoyWorld we show some of things that are cooking but not prime time ready yet. When they are webinars and other things certainly will follow.
We use jQuery mobile with Servoy and have developed several mobile apps. We have also wrapped then with native wrappers and submitted them to Apple App Store and Android Market.
goldcougar:
We use jQuery mobile with Servoy and have developed several mobile apps. We have also wrapped then with native wrappers and submitted them to Apple App Store and Android Market.
Same applies to Sencha Touch - works well with Servoy and has a nice gui in the form of Sencha Architect. Looking forward to seeing what Servoy can create if its along similar lines to Architect then we would change in a heart beat. Key requirements would be UX and ability to wrap the result for app store delivery like JQMobile, Sencha Touch, JQTouch et al
john.allen:
…Probably if Bob had been there doing it you would have even been able to hear it across the pond.Perhaps it is all part of a cooler, laid-back Servoy image!
HA! Thanks, John!
I’m also looking forward to what they’re cooking up. Hopefully they’ll have some “Fluid” design elements in there (http://www.alistapart.com/articles/fluidgrids/) - as that IS the future!
Gordon McLean:
Same applies to Sencha Touch - works well with Servoy and has a nice gui in the form of Sencha Architect.
And it’s dead easy to implement the Servoy side with Velocity
bobcusick1332964082:
john.allen:
…Probably if Bob had been there doing it you would have even been able to hear it across the pond.Perhaps it is all part of a cooler, laid-back Servoy image!
HA! Thanks, John!
I’m also looking forward to what they’re cooking up. Hopefully they’ll have some “Fluid” design elements in there (http://www.alistapart.com/articles/fluidgrids/) - as that IS the future!
Fluid design elements for web applications and single page web deployed applications are two different beasts. That article deals with websites. In the latter department, Servoy already has the “fluid design element” (otherwise known as a layout manager widget) that matters most: split tab panel. With anchoring it adapts to the viewing environment. I would also add that it compares favorably to other technologies’ layout managers in capabilities and is even easier to use. Love the the split tab panel component.
The goal of responsive web design is to use one code base for all device deployments. Web applications however don’t work as well trying to fit into this one-size-fits-all approach as user interaction, navigation, and code optimization is quite different across the board.
Consequently, most client-side technologies (ie, Sencha, KendoUI, JQuery Mobile) use two different sets of widgets for mobile (smaller devices) and desktop browsers. With very different look and feels, navigation approaches, and form patterns. The mobile device set of widgets typically try to emulate the device’s native look and feel (iOS, Android, Blackberry, [slot reserved for W8]) automatically without any input from the developer.
What I hope they do then is really nail the mobile widgets instead of trying to build something “fluid” in the website sense where one code base works on mobile and desktop browsers. Widgets that have native look and feel on all devices (or go the route of jQuery Mobile here and have some easy to use themes), an easy way to hook up navigation, tablet specific widgets like fly-out panes, deployment build optimization (not sure if current Wicket produced markup is up to this…), upgrade style sheets to use Compass/SaaS (maybe not needed with their server-side approach), etc. (While they’re at it, build a better table technology: ie. “infinite scrolling” tables – now that IS the future of grids…)
Servoy will never be a tool to build websites. However, putting a Servoy web client “widget” on a website via an iframe works great. Good enough compromise.
In the speculation department, building all their own mobile widgets seems seems a little out of character for Servoy. I suspect they are building server-side wrappers for a client-side library like jQuery. That would be pretty cool.
ptalbot:
Gordon McLean:
Same applies to Sencha Touch - works well with Servoy and has a nice gui in the form of Sencha Architect.And it’s dead easy to implement the Servoy side with Velocity
In the meantime, Servoy is for sure a fantastic backend technology for client-side libraries out there.
PS. Try working with Sencha Architect for 100 hours and then see how much you like it…
david:
In the meantime, Servoy is for sure a fantastic backend technology for client-side libraries out there.
PS. Try working with Sencha Architect for 100 hours and then see how much you like it…
Servoy is for sure a fantastic backend technology. All the more so with Velocity
But in the end, it all depends on the IDE/RAD tool you are used to…
Consider asking someone accustomed to Sencha (or any other production tool) to work 100 hours in Servoy (or any other RAD) and he will not be as happy as you are.
As usual you only can achieve good productivity when you are really mastering your environment.
Oh we mastered Sencha Architect all right. The issue with it is that it just missing tons of key things. Like not being able to modify code directly for example. I could go on and on…
It covers the simple things that someone new to Sencha would find very helpful. Get past that point and it’s just so much easier to hand code your whole project.
In no way can you compare Sencha Architect to Servoy IDE. Maybe in a year or two…
I don’t think targeting mobile for more than a few pages of lists and limited interaction is really viable at the moment. I’m not even sure it will ever be. I mean, can you imagine entering complex forms on a small phone touch screen? I must have big fingers but I cringe at the very idea…
Mobile devices, as far as I see it are very much consuming devices, not something you create much input with unless you are 14 years old and type in SMS cryptic code and believe that a tweet is the be and and all of information.
So having a simple IDE that helps creating these pages and limited screens with some easy widgets in a simple way is totally valuable I think. Having to code all this manually with the amount of tweaks this requires for various targets is not something I aspire to do personnaly. So if something like Sencha can ease the pain, and even if it is nowhere near the value of Servoy in terms of coding, why not? Not sure coding is what is needed for mobile sites. Good widgets that translates well on all devices with as little coding as possible is what I’m looking for.
But Servoy is no help in that matter. It is a very good back-end, yes, but in no way a mobile platform right now, this of course can change in the future, although if I were to say something about it, I would say that I kind of fear it as much as I anticipate it.
Smart client possibilities were already tread off for the sake of having something that more or less translates to Web client, I fear that having another kind of client could mean reducing all of them to their least common denominator… A mistake I hope Servoy will not make!
ptalbot:
So having a simple IDE that helps creating these pages and limited screens with some easy widgets in a simple way is totally valuable I think. Having to code all this manually with the amount of tweaks this requires for various targets is not something I aspire to do personnaly. So if something like Sencha can ease the pain, and even if it is nowhere near the value of Servoy in terms of coding, why not? Not sure coding is what is needed for mobile sites. Good widgets that translates well on all devices with as little coding as possible is what I’m looking for.
This is the sweet spot for Architect. Which is about 10% of what Sencha can do and is used for. The tool will get better but currently that 10% line is very easy to get to and cross over and then Architect becomes less useful in a hurry. Just something to be aware of I think.
ptalbot:
But Servoy is no help in that matter. It is a very good back-end, yes, but in no way a mobile platform right now, this of course can change in the future, although if I were to say something about it, I would say that I kind of fear it as much as I anticipate it.
Smart client possibilities were already tread off for the sake of having something that more or less translates to Web client, I fear that having another kind of client could mean reducing all of them to their least common denominator… A mistake I hope Servoy will not make!
I thought it was my job to say what everyone is thinking Totally agree and couldn’t say it better.
ptalbot:
Smart client possibilities were already tread off for the sake of having something that more or less translates to Web client, I fear that having another kind of client could mean reducing all of them to their least common denominator… A mistake I hope Servoy will not make!
As discussed at ServoyWorld as of 6.1 we have stopped with the least common denominator. In 6.1 we have started introducing some functions that are not possible (or to hard) to implement in smart client but are available in web-client. In Mobile this will continue as the paradigm is very different from desktop applications. So while single codebase is still important you will start to see more client specific features in future versions.
In the next weeks we will organize a 6.1 webinar and after that a webinar to showcase where Servoy Mobile stands at the moment. Keep an eye on the events page.
Jan Aleman:
In Mobile this will continue as the paradigm is very different from desktop applications. So while single codebase is still important you will start to see more client specific features in future versions.
Good to know, Jan! Thanks for the update on Servoy’s vision. It’s reassuring.
david:
Servoy 6.1 is a huge release with some very cool features and there are no demos or a webinar scheduled to show it off –
We’ve scheduled a webinar. Paul Bakker, product manager, will be presenting:
https://www1.gotomeeting.com/register/233573456