After upgrading (without any choice) to Leopard recently, I have struggled with font sizes changing, button shapes / sizes / transparency changing, dataproviders sizes and transparency etc. on solutions which worked just fine in Java 1.5 on Mac OS X 10.4. It has made developing and deploying difficult recently
Today I switched back to java 1.4.2 (not least because it at least allows me to run Servoy 2.2 and 3.1 on a Leopard machine at all…) It all looks, feels and behaves beautifully (and familiarly).
My questions are: 1. Are there any reasons not to just stay in Java 1.4.2? It seems to work just fine with Servoy from versions 2.2 through 3.5.
does anyone know if there is ever going to be a version of Java on the Mac which fixes what Apple broke? Are we actually waiting for Apple to do something or do they think that everything is hunky dory in Mac Java Land (yes I have submitted a bug report to them…)
Are there any reasons not to just stay in Java 1.4.2? It seems to work just fine with Servoy from versions 2.2 through 3.5.
I know 1.4.2 works fine with 2.2.x. Just do some tests if all the new (3.1.x/3.5.x) beans/plugins keep working properly with 1.4.2.
I suspect it isn’t an issue.
Thunder:
2. does anyone know if there is ever going to be a version of Java on the Mac which fixes what Apple broke? Are we actually waiting for Apple to do something or do they think that everything is hunky dory in Mac Java Land (yes I have submitted a bug report to them…)
Apple is working on a Java 6 version. Right now it’s only available as a Developer Preview and only works on Intel and only in 64bit.
Apple is annoyingly tightlipped about what the future of Java on Mac OS X is so nobody other than Apple can tell you what the future holds.
One thing is for sure. Java is now becoming OpenSource and a guy named Landon Fuller already ported the BSD version of Java 6 (which actually isn’t fully OpenSource yet, license-wise) to Mac OS X. Only downside on that version is that it only supports X-Window for GUI apps and no OpenGL support. But for non-GUI apps (like Servoy Server) it should work wonderfully.
So what will the future hold for Java on Mac? I suspect we will get a community developed version (just like WebKit and some other core systems of Mac OS X)
But time will tell.
In my experience using the current ADC Java6 version with Servoy 2.2. is not really an option. It usually hangs after a few minutes.
Servoy 3.5 does work with Leopard and Java 1.5 so no real need to upgrade to a pre-alpha Java 6 I would say.
Right now I do all of my (2.2.x) development in VMWare with XP because of this.
Thunder:
Is it all just a pipe dream and nothing will ever go back to how it was when it just worked ??
Servoy 3.5 does work with Leopard and Java 1.5 so no real need to upgrade to a pre-alpha Java 6 I would say.
I wouldn’t say it works. If I use the Mac LAF, all my print forms are destroyed, UI elements are broken, transparency doesn’t work, its buggy and slower, etc.
The reason for my question was originally because of 1.5 and Leopard and Servoy 3.5. It looks awful. It is only switching back to 1.4.2 that fixes it. The question is, is 1.4.2 my permanent solution? or is Apple going to make Java look anything like what it used to (I know that you don’t know the answer, I’ve been watching Apple and their funky antics for 15 years as a database developer and AASP and and know all too well).
The point is though, are we all waiting for something to happen or have we all just moved on (lesson: don’t use Apple LAF, and rebuild 200+ forms so that they print properly again)?
Servoy 3.5 does work with Leopard and Java 1.5 so no real need to upgrade to a pre-alpha Java 6 I would say.
I wouldn’t say it works. If I use the Mac LAF, all my print forms are destroyed, UI elements are broken, transparency doesn’t work, its buggy and slower, etc.
Can you show some screenshots of what you are talking about ? What UI elements are broken, where does transparency not work, etc.
Also what version of Servoy are you using ?
I am a bit irritated, as I don’t seem to have any of your described problems with leopard. We develop the application still (mainly) on tiger, but it looks and behaves the same under Leopard (Java 1.5), without any modifications.
I think you have to supply more details according to what UI elements are broken etc. as all my UI elements just work fine (as far as I tested). So I could test on our app if you supply more info.
Regards, Robert
Thunder:
Servoy 3.5 does work with Leopard and Java 1.5 so no real need to upgrade to a pre-alpha Java 6 I would say.
I wouldn’t say it works. If I use the Mac LAF, all my print forms are destroyed, UI elements are broken, transparency doesn’t work, its buggy and slower, etc.
The reason for my question was originally because of 1.5 and Leopard and Servoy 3.5. It looks awful. It is only switching back to 1.4.2 that fixes it. The question is, is 1.4.2 my permanent solution? or is Apple going to make Java look anything like what it used to (I know that you don’t know the answer, I’ve been watching Apple and their funky antics for 15 years as a database developer and AASP and and know all too well).
The point is though, are we all waiting for something to happen or have we all just moved on (lesson: don’t use Apple LAF, and rebuild 200+ forms so that they print properly again)?
I’m running 3.5.5 on Leopard here, default LAF and Verdana 12.
Works fine, except for:
Password field in login dialog box partially obscured, but works fine.
Have to use tab key instead of ‘enter’ to trigger ‘on_data-change’ in fields. This is irritating, but as long as the users know, it is not going to stop them from working.
Versions of Servoy prior to 3.5.x do not run at all. UI fails to display.
We only develop on 3.5.x anyway. It is the best Servoy version so far.
I’m using the just released Java 1.6 and it’s working fine for me, the only issue I’ve seen so far is checkboxes background not correctly rendered but that’s a minor thing.
I also have installed java 1.6 on Leopard 10.5.2 and there are a few minor problems (the radio buttons background is not transparent). Some other issues have been corrected (e.g. graphics are now centered correctly on buttons etc so I do not need to set margins manually, but I now have to revert all previous settings to 0,0,0,0).
I read somewhere that if one is using the Sun-based renderers for graphics (the default for the J2SE 5 and JSE 6 on Apple) to have transparencies work, one should change GraphicsConfiguration.createCompatibleImage(w, h) to GraphicsConfiguration.createCompatibleImage(w, h, Transparency.TRANSLUCENT).
Any Java-savvy servoyan is able to tell me where can I find this command and how to modify it?
Servoy Developer
Version 3.5.5-build 518
Java version 1.6.0_05-b13-52 (Mac OS X)
So this is hopeless without Apple or Java fix? I have been trying to figure this out all week and have been editing my application to make the buttons/radio buttons/checkboxes etc bigger and playing with transparency/background colors to accomodate the new Leopard machines coming online at my client. In case anyone at Servoy is still not seeing this – attached is a screen shot of the Servoy parts window in Leopard in either Java 5 or Java 6 (look at the down button, the add button, the RemovebyGroup button) – it works in Java 1.4.2 but my IT2BE plugins fail. So to say again, everything in the Servoy app I’ve developed works on all versions of Windows and on Tiger, then on Leopard with any modern Java all my buttons etc fail. This is in the Default Mac LAF or the MacOS X LAF, no matter what font size I specify. If I change to Kunstoff for the macs or force Kunstoff out via the server to the macs, everything looks fine but then none of the comboboxes work (they appear blank).
Help?
I know I’m going to hear I need to wait for apple or java to help, but I’m hoping there’s any other option – esp since Servoy app is affected in Leopard Java 5 or 6?
Hey Marcel – it’s fine in Java 1.4.2, so that makes it a Java deal, no? Or java with apple combo since Tiger with java 5 works fine. I sent it to Servoy. They all use Leopard from what I’ve seen at the conferences, they must have seen this.
ellenmeserow:
Hey Marcel – it’s fine in Java 1.4.2, so that makes it a Java deal, no?
I assume it’s a bit more complex. It’s as if your car stands still - it’s the car maker, no? Except you have no petrol in your tank, or your battery doesn’t work any more or …
So I assume Apple was adjusting some minor size things, which may have great effects (and that’s why some companies just don’t fix anything, so it stays always the same (which is a bad strategy for long term in my opinion). Sometimes fixes on what side ever have (bad interim) consequences.
After all, different companies or groups are working on Java, so one can assume not everything is consistent (as we would like it). But this is true if a product is developed by one single company, like (huchhh, no name here
ellenmeserow:
Or java with apple combo since Tiger with java 5 works fine. I sent it to Servoy. They all use Leopard from what I’ve seen at the conferences, they must have seen this.
After all may be it’s still best to send an erro report (although sometimes annoying and time consuming .
OK, this is serious. Nothing I’ve designed for printing PRINTs from Leopard. I get mostly blank pages – all kinds of forms. I’ve tried Java 6 64-bit, Java 5 64-bit, Java 5 32-bit. Only on Java 1.4.2 does anything print, and with that every IT2BE plugin fails. Help? I sent it to support@servoy. Sending again. I am sure some of you have solutions on Leopard, no?
Ellen, sorry if I am asking something you have answered already - I jumped to the end of the thread as I was looking for something else but I wondered if you have filed a case about your issue as well as mailing support@ ?
